Yesterday, my brother-in-law, Nathan Williams, asked some questions on his blog about men and their thoughts on modesty. I tried to respond but for some reason his spam filter kept telling me my comment seemed spammy and wouldn’t let it be posted. So I sent it to him in e-mail to see if he could get it posted. He decided to post it as his blog entry today. Thanks, Nathan, for posting that. And I appreciate you striving to protect my rep by keeping it anonymous. However, I think one of the reasons we keep hearing from church after church about men falling, especially preachers and elders, is because we act like none of us ever have any real problems with lust.
I mean, sure, every man admits that he has lusted at some time or other. But it’s just those “sicko” people out there that have a problem. So we ignore and stuff our real problems, afraid to share until they become so powerfully overwhelming that we fall into a snare of the devil, into condemnation, and into disgrace.
Well, the fact is Jesus came into the world to save sickos like me. If I didn’t have any problems, I wouldn’t need Jesus. As I said in the chapter I was privileged to write for Behind the Preacher’s Door, lust is one of the four horsemen of my personal apocalypse (the others are gluttony, covetousness, and pride). I have turned to Jesus because these things have driven me there. I’m grateful because God is giving me progressive victory over these struggles. My struggles with lust aren’t what they used to be. However, I’m learning that I only continue to have victory when I remember that these are very present struggles. When I think of them as things I used to have problems with, then Satan jumps up and smacks me down. So, today, I have to rely completely on Jesus to fight the good fight of faith against the temptations to lust. Part of that fight is being completely honest and letting the light shine on the dark places in my soul. I hope no one simply dismisses me as a sicko pervert. But if they do, that will be between them and God, not me.
When Nathan told me he was going to post my comment today. I sent a note saying, “Wait, let me make it better.” But our notes passed in cyberspace. So, you can see the Cliff’s Notes version at the Mandeville Church’s blog or you can read the full version here. I also want to apologize for how long this is. I know that good bloggers say this post should only be about 1/6th of the size it is. But this is deep stuff that I can’t simply bullet-point down into a concise blog post.
Do I Notice Immodesty?
Yesterday, Nathan asked us men, “Do you notice immodesty around you?” Well, duh. I’m a man. God has created me to be visually stimulated. I think that is why Jesus’ words in Matthew 5:27-30 are directed at men. While women can also lust, we men are the ones more susceptible to it because we are more visual. That’s why we men need to think like Job who said, “I have made a covenant with my eyes; how then could I gaze at the virgin?” (Job 31:1). Gazing is our problem.
Do I notice? Try as hard as I can not to, I notice.
What Triggers Lust?
Nathan asked, “What do you consider immodest on women?” Rather than stating what I consider immodest, as if I can establish the bounds and lines of modesty, let me rather share what I have found to trigger my lust.
Cleavage. Even the slightest hint of it. I can’t help but wonder why a woman wants to let me see part of her breasts. I mean, if I’m seeing cleavage, I’m also seeing the breasts that surround the cleavage.
Anything that draws attention to a woman’s breasts or buttocks. That includes form-fitting clothing but also includes clothing with writing that begs me to look at a woman in those triggering areas.
Thighs. Thighs definitely cause a problem.
If the belly is showing or if the pants are riding low and a woman’s underwear or the beginning of the roundness of her buttocks is peeking out. This is especially triggering if the woman has a tattoo peeking out of the top of her pants. Don’t ask me why, but if a woman has a tattoo showing out of her pants, it makes me think she is sexually easy. That is certainly an improper judgment on my part, but there it is. I guess I think if she would let some guy get his hands all over that part of her body to paint it, she must be willing to let anyone do that.
But the triggering issues are not just about dress. There is also behavior, stature, and deportment. Some women stand with breasts thrust forward. Some women sit with legs spread apart like a man. Some women walk with extra wiggle. All of these stimulate sexual thinking and lust.
Some women talk in suggestive ways, pushing the envelope on propriety. I think this may come from the idea that guys talk like that and some women just want to be one of the guys. First, guys shouldn’t talk like that. Second, when a woman does, I’m not thinking, “Oh, here’s a woman who is just one of the guys.” I’m thinking, “Oh, here’s a woman who is probably sexually easy.” I know some women recognize this. In a marriage counseling session, a wife who had cheated on her husband admitted to me that she could tell when she could seduce a man by talking in a certain way to him and seeing how he responded. It isn’t just dress, but speech that heightens sexual tension and tests the sexual waters gets those lust engines running.
Okay, I’m probably going too far and letting too many of my cats out of the bag here. I’m sure the sisters will think, “That guy’s got a problem,” and they’re right. But there it is.
What Triggered Solomon’s Desire OR I’m Not the Only One
However, I know I’m not the only one with triggers like this. In Song of Solomon 4:1-11; 6:5-7:9, the man talks about what triggers him sexually about his bride. In marriage, this is beautiful. God has given these gifts to woman so she can stimulate and please her husband. However, I believe women need to recognize that these things can trigger men outside of marriage and, therefore, be careful how they present themselves when they are in the public eye. Notice what Solomon claimed was sexually triggering. By the way, I’m not saying a woman has to keep all of these things completely covered. I’m simply saying it would be helpful to think about how these things are presented to men because they can be triggering.
Breasts: Song of Solomon 4:5; 7:3, 7
Eyes: Song of Solomon 4:1, 9; 6:5; 7:4
Hair: Song of Solomon 4:1; 6:5; 7:5
Teeth: Song of Solomon 4:2; 6:6
Lips, mouth: Song of Solomon 4:3; 7:8-9
Cheeks: Song of Solomon 4:3; 6:7
Neck: Song of Solomon 4:4; 7:4
Jewelry: Song of Solomon 4:9
Perfume: Song of Solomon 4:6, 11
Feet: Song of Solomon 7:1
Thighs: Song of Solomon 7:1
Navel and belly: Song of Solomon 7:2
Stature: Song of Solomon 7:7
Words: Okay this one isn’t in Song of Solomon. But you can find it in Proverbs 5:3; 6:24.
How Does It Affect Me?
Yesterday, Nathan asked, “How does it affect you?” That is an interesting question. I’m sure it affects each man differently. But then again, maybe I’m a good example of what immodesty and lust do to every man.
First, it affects my judgment of the person who is triggering my lust. This is very self-centered and wrong; I shouldn’t think this, but I often do. The judgment that often jumps into my mind about the person dressing in a way that excites my lust is that the person must be interested in inciting my lust. I can very quickly think that person intends to be sexual. If she is willing to be sexual at the level of dress, she is probably willing to be sexual at deeper levels. Intellectually, I know this isn’t true. Some women dress and act this way out of ignorance. Some do so because of their own past hurts and insecurities. Some do so because our culture has trained them that they are only worthwhile when they are sexy. No doubt, some do so because they are “easy.” But no matter the reason the woman is dressing that way, it is that final reason that often jumps into my mind.
Second, it increases my desire. One problem with lust is that it is addictive. Just like any addiction, you gain tolerance. When a person is addicted to alcohol they have to drink more and more to get the same buzz they used to get. Lust is the exact same way. So, when I see an immodestly dressed woman who triggers my lust, it makes me want to see more. I want to see more immodestly dressed women and I want to see women who are less dressed. Sadly, Satan has provided an all too easy way in our modern technological world for me to see more women and less dress. Seeing more is always only a click away. No matter what commitments I have made to myself, to others, to God, to my wife… no matter how good I’ve been and how much victory I’ve had, when an immodest woman comes into view, Satan smacks me with the urge to see more.
Third, lust distracts me from reality. I remember watching a show or a movie in which a man was staring at a woman and she said, “Take a picture; it will last longer.” That just goes to show that women don’t understand the mind of a man. Pictures fade. Pictures can be destroyed. Pictures can be lost. But the image in my mind can be there until I die. And it usually is just waiting for a moment when reality isn’t enough for me. It usually sits there under cover until I hit a moment in the day that is stressful, boring, or otherwise troublesome. Then it jumps out at me, taking over my mind, inviting me to escape from the hard reality into the easy world of fantasy. My evil thoughts, sinful passions, and self-centered judgments all coalesce to keep me from living in the real world.
Fourth, it destroys my relationship with my wife. I love my wife. I don’t want to be with anyone but my wife. But being married is about living in reality and that just isn’t always easy. It is completely unfair to my wife for me to come home all raging to be sexual with her because I saw someone else that turned me on and have now been fantasizing all day (even if the fantasies were about my wife). Lust causes me to place unreasonable and unfair sexual expectations on her, expectations she can’t possibly fulfill. Then I have resentment and get mad at her, which causes her to have resentment and get mad at me, which causes me to have resentment and get mad at her, which causes her…you get the picture. These fantasies are dangerous because my wife cannot possibly be the “sex-kitten” I’ve been envisioning in my fantasies. After all, men, in our fantasies, our wives are just sitting around waiting for us to get home so we can have sex. They aren’t cleaning house, caring for kids, cooking meals, doing laundry, and getting exhausted. NEWSFLASH! Reality sets in and what suffers for all this is my marriage and my relationship with my wife.
Finally, I appreciate what I learned from a friend of mine who is in 12-step recovery for alcohol. He has a saying that reminds him why he needs to maintain the fight against his drinking and why he needs to continue to rely on God every day. He claims to have three options in his life: 1) locked up, 2) covered up, or 3) sobered up. That is, he can either remain sober or his drinking will get him arrested or killed. I’ve heard enough stories to recognize that lust is the same way. I know men who are in jail because their lusts led them to do illegal things. I also know of men whose lusts have killed them, either because their lust led them to act out sexually and get a disease or because it put them in dangerous circumstances and got them killed by a pimp, prostitute, an irate husband, or even an angered mistress. Anybody remember what happened to Steve McNair a few years ago? I also know of some men whose lust became so overpowering they thought the only way out was suicide. I’m very thankful that my lusts haven’t taken me where some have gone…yet. And I add that “yet” purposefully. Because none of the men I’ve talked to whose lusts have ruined their lives thought they would do some of the things they did. I’ve learned that I can’t control and enjoy a little lust. If I give into it at all, it will take me places I didn’t think I would ever go. In fact, it has already done that. How does lust affect me? It gives me only three choices: Locked up, covered up, or sobered up. So today, I want to rely on God instead of hanging out in lust.
What Do I Do About It?
I’ve thought about gouging out my eyes. But I was afraid that would seriously hinder every other aspect of my life. So, I’ve pursued some other options.
First, I’ve decided to quit thinking that it’s the immodest women’s fault (though, I sure wish they would cut me some slack). In other words, women need to be modest because it is the right thing to do, not simply because it causes me problems. I’m sure some women are thinking, “Man, that guy has a problem.” And they are right. I do have a problem. Immodest women also have a problem, but I can’t do anything about their problem. I can only work on me. Lust is my problem and through Jesus, I need to overcome it. As long as I blame immodest women, I’m going to continue in my problem. That would be a lot like blaming Chinese buffets for my gluttony. So, some time ago, I decided the person I needed to work on was me. I need to clean up my side of the immodesty/lust street. While there are passages on immodesty for women (e.g. I Timothy 2:9-10; I Peter 3:3-4), Matthew 5:28 is not one of them. That passage is about me. I’m not supposed to lust no matter how women dress. That is what I have to work on today.
Second, I’ve decided I can’t overcome on my own. As Paul said in Romans 7:24-25, I can’t deliver me from my body of death. Only God can do that through Jesus Christ. So, I do everything I can to consciously connect with God, recognizing that only He provides the victory.
So, I pray. I start my day praying that God will protect me from my own lust. Psalm 141:3-5 is a guide for this prayer. I ask God to do whatever it takes to keep me from lust today, even if it means letting the righteous smite me. I also love to pray Psalm 139:23-24. I ask God to search in every nook and cranny of my heart to find every grievous way there is and cleanse them from me so I can walk in His everlasting way.
I pray through the day, practicing what I call, walking in God’s presence. That is, I talk to God as if He is walking along with me. I tell Him what I’m thinking, what choices I’m making, what choices I just made, asking Him permission to do what I’m thinking about. I’ve found it is really hard to look down a woman’s blouse if I’m asking God for permission. I wish I used this tool more consistently. It really helps when I walk in God’s presence.
In the moment of temptation, when I catch myself looking and lusting, I pray a prayer I read some time ago, “Lord, let me find in You whatever it is I’m looking for in _____________________.” I know there is some hole I’m trying to fill in my life by escaping into the fantasy world of lust. I’ve also learned that going into that world never fills the hole. Only God can. So I ask Him to help me figure out what the hole behind the lust really is and ask His strength to help me let Him fill it. As Psalm 18:1-3 says, God needs to be my refuge, not lust and fantasy.
Additionally, I start praying for the person that triggered my lust. I pray for her blessing, I pray for her husband or potential husband, her kids, her hopes, her dreams, her forgiveness. If her immodesty is an obvious you-can’t-miss-it plea to be noticed sexually, I pray for whatever it is that makes her think she is only worthwhile if she dresses like that. I realize she must be a hurting person and pray for those hurts to be healed. I pray that I can be a blessing in her life, a giver rather than a taker. I pray for anything I can about her to remind me that she is a person and not a piece of candy for my eyes or a piece of meat for my fantasies later.
In addition to praying, I spend time connecting to God through helpful literature. Obviously, that begins with the Bible. But I no longer read the Bible with the mindset of thinking, “Maybe if I read my Bible more, I’ll be strong enough.” I’ve learned I won’t ever be strong enough. I’ll only be strong when I know how weak I am, because that will cause me to rely on God’s strength instead of my own (II Corinthians 12:7-10). I spend time in God’s Word to connect to His strength. Since every part of the armor of God in Ephesians 6:14-17 is connected to God’s Word, it stands to reason that immersing myself in God’s words of life will help.
One thing that has really been helping me lately is scripture memorization. Certainly, that helps because as I hide God’s word in my heart, I won’t sin against Him (Psalm 119:11). But also because I’ve started working on scripture memorization during those boring times, like when I’m driving or walking. Now my mind has something to focus on that is true, lovely, of good report instead of drifting into fantasy. I’ve learned that if I have problems with obsessing about things when I’m distracted or bored, at least I can direct that obsessive thinking to something constructive.
In addition to the Bible, I also read literature that is specifically designed to help me grow. I read literature that challenges me to rely on God, that challenges me to grow, that gives me good advice for growth. I especially read literature that deals specifically with lust and sexual sins. There are plenty of books out there written to give men insight into why lust is a problem and how to overcome. Even though these books aren’t inspired, I view them as God placing good counselors in my path to help me overcome by His strength (Proverbs 11:14).
Finally, I connect to God by connecting to other people. I have friends that I have been completely and 100% honest with about all my struggles. I’m glad to say that Nathan is one of those people. I especially have friends that I call when I’m tempted and triggered. I have friends I can call to lay out on the table exactly what I saw and what it made me think. I’ve found if I try to stuff it inside and deal with it myself, I just end up obsessing about it. However, if I go ahead and shed the light on it by sharing it with someone else, the darkness usually goes away. Of course, there have been some times that I’ve had to make multiple calls before it went away.
I’ve also learned that the issue is not simply lust. I’ve learned that lust is usually a reaction to other issues. Sometimes things have been going great in the battle against lust and I begin to think that I am not ever going to have a problem again and then bang, out of nowhere I’ve crumbled on the battlefield. Then I start doing a debrief and realize that the real problem wasn’t lust. In some cases lust was just the reaction to a resentment I had over something with my wife. Or it was a reaction to a frustration I was feeling with a brother in Christ. Or it was a reaction to stress and pressure in my work. I’ve learned there is a better way to deal with all of those things. Phone a friend, it really is a lifeline.
So, my first line of defense is to quit blaming others. My second is to connect to God. My third line of defense is to cut off my hand and pluck out my eye (cf. Matthew 5:29-30). Not literally; but I’ve learned there are some shows (CSI: Miami), some songs (Nickelback’s “Rockstar”), some places (magazine aisles) that tend to have people or things that trigger my lust. As much as I can, I cut them out. I’m not saying you have to cut them out, they may not trigger your lust. But they do mine. So I’ve had to cut them out. However, I do have a request. I can’t cut out the church’s assembly. So, sisters, while it is my problem and I have to clean up my side of the street, I sure could use some help. Please dress modestly when you are getting together with the church. I tend to think that ought to be a place where I can safely go and find help, not find more of the battle.
Wrapping Up
Okay, I could write a book on this stuff. In fact, if you’ve read all of this, you probably are thinking, “He did write a book.” But that’s how sick I’ve been in my life. The great thing is I know that God is giving me progressive victory over all of this. My troubles aren’t what they used to be. At the same time, I’ll only keep having victory as I keep relying on God instead of me. If I quit relying on Him, I’ll just go back to being dominated by lust. So there you have it. Hope I haven’t said too much. And I hope I still have a job this Sunday. We’ll see.
What are your thoughts on modesty and lust? What do you do to overcome? Add your input by clicking the following link: Comments
And now it is time to work up the courage to hit “Publish.” Here goes.
Edwin – this is a good article man. The most salient point you state – in my humble opinion – is that besides separating us from God, lust distracts us from reality. That is so true!
I wish I could say I was perfectly immune to lust; but alas… that would be a naked lie. With internet access and filth all around us, it’s easy to fall into those dark corners of our world and feed that temptation. Openness with my wife has helped steer me from those dark places; and her understanding and grace has helped me feel comfort to do that.
I’m an administrator at a Christian school in south-central Alabama. It is as alive here as ever; girls actually embrace the lusty stuff, because they like the attention and the neck-jerks to see them. It has to be changed on a number of levels; but as Arterburn says, “bouncing the eyes” is critical to mastering your own self-control and moral propriety.
-blessings,
Drew Ellis
Thanks, Drew.
Eye-bouncing is absolutely necessary. Your comment brings up one of the great problems. In high school, during that time we are just waking up sexually, we are actually trained to look. We are trained to find. At that age, it excites us like nothing else has and we don’t even really know why.
Now, here I am 20 years after high school and still having to work extra hard to not react the way I was trained in high school.
I remember the time when I was wondering why I couldn’t seem to control my lust and its consequences and as I examined what was going on I discovered that I had actually been feeding my lust without even realizing it because I was constantly on the lookout for someone that might be dressed in a tantalizing fashion. Up until then I thought it had to be really, really immodest to be a problem for me. When in reality, I was stealing all kinds of glances and not even realizing it.
Bouncing the eyes is important. If I catch myself looking twice, I have to consciously force myself to look away. Or if I catch myself wondering, “Oh, I wonder what she looks like from the front,” (or from the back for that matter) I have to force myself to look away. The greatest trick my lust tries to play on me is to let me see a woman and then think, “Oh, I wonder if she will be a triggering woman that I need to avoid. I should look to make sure.” When I catch myself thinking that, I have to just look away.
Then my lust tries to make me feel bad, like I’m missing out on something I have a right to. Then I have to remind myself, I don’t have a right to that look. Or that lust. I have to surrender it to God.
My post was an essay. Now my comments is a post. See how easy it is to get going on this stuff.
Thanks for the comment, Drew.
Thank you so much for your humble, honest thoughts. I need to learn to address my own struggles in the same manner. I’m a sister, and I hope my dress helps and doesn’t hurt!
Thank you for your help in this matter. That is always greatly appreciated.
From a male perspective, can you address the female that justifies her revealing clothing based on her perception that her body-type or size will not cause a man to lust? The rationale I have heard is: “Skinny girls shouldn’t dress immodestly, but nobody’s going to be lusting after *my* body.”
Hi Amy, thanks for your question.
My first response is that I Timothy 2:9-10 and I Peter 3:3-4 do not instruct modesty in order to keep men from lusting. As I said in the post, lusting is the luster’s problem. Immodest dress is the dresser’s problem. Immodesty, that is, seeking to draw attention to yourself through some means other than godliness whether through showing flesh or through flashy jewelry or ostentatious clothing, is wrong no matter what anyone else thinks of it or does with it.
My second response is while those passages don’t say be modest so you won’t be a stumbling block, the Bible does teach against being a stumbling block. Luke 17:1 says it is better to have a millstone hung about your neck than to cast a stumbling block before someone. In fact, Matthew 13:41 says that everyone who is a stumbling block will be removed from the kingdom.
Of course, you are saying that someone is saying they can’t possibly be a stumbling block because of their body style. If only it were so simple. But it isn’t. I’ve been hanging out with guys my whole life. And while there does seem to be a cultural stereotype of what is “sexy” and lust-inducing, that is by no means the standard for every man. The fact is for every body type out there, there are men who are turned on by it. This is demonstrated by the amazing variety of pornography that is available. I don’t want to get graphic or encourage anyone to look for any of this. But trust me, there is pornography out there for every body type. That alone demonstrates that everyone fits the perfect profile for someone’s favorite form of eye candy.
My third point would be, since the person admits it is immodest and would be awful on a different body type, why are they wearing it? What do they hope to accomplish by it? Are they hoping that maybe, just maybe, someone will get turned on by them if they wear this? Or are they so insecure in their body that they think they have to dress like this to get some kind of attention? It just makes no sense to me for someone to say “immodest” clothes are okay for them because no one would take notice.
My two cents, for what their worth.
To add to that…
The wisdom given in Proverbs 5 seems to apply here. Drink water from your own cistern, flowing water from your own well. Should your springs be scattered abroad, streams of water in the streets? Let them be for yourself alone, and not for strangers with you. Let your fountain be blessed, and rejoice in the wife of your youth, a lovely deer, a graceful doe. Let her breasts fill you at all times with delight; be intoxicated always in her love. –Proverbs 5:15-19
Regardless of what she looks like, a woman’s body is reserved for the satisfaction of her husband. That includes visual stimulus. If she is unmarried, then she should certainly not be showing her body in any form (rather fully revealed, partially revealed, tightly revealed, seductively prepared, etc.) to man. If she is married, then she should not be sharing those views with anyone but her husband.
The same passage means that men are to only be satisfied by their wives. And therefore, we have no right to be using women who share with us views that don’t belong to us through their apparel as a form of stimulant or excitement.
just a couple more cents to add on…
Thanks for the additional cents. And right on the money. If men are commanded to drink from their own cistern, then women shouldn’t be offering drinks from their cistern to men they aren’t married to, no matter how bad they think the water is.
Great point. And thanks for bringing this back to us men who are responsible to to only go to one source no matter how many drinks other women offer us.
If anyone else has something to add to this question, I’d welcome it.
Edwin, thanks for your candor and honesty on this issue. As you can tell from the responses to your blog, this is a hot topic. I received many e-mail responses as I discussed modesty the past couple of days with my church family. Modesty is (normally) the woman’s battle. Lust is (normally) the man’s battle. Let’s fight hard, Brothers and Sisters!
Thanks for asking the questions that prompted me to dig deeper.
Thanks, Edwin. Good article. Right on target. Much needed. Charlie B.
Thanks for the encouragement, Charlie.
I once heard Luther Bolenbarker in a lesson say, “If a guy doesn’t notice, he is either too young… or too old.” I think there is some wisdom there.
Thanks for your thoughts on this. You did great work as always.
Awesome! I now have hope that one day I’ll be so old this won’t bother me anymore. Any guesses as to when that age comes?
Excellent post, Edwin. And here’s another rationalization Satan has taught us to say to ourselves, “Just because I’m on a diet doesn’t mean I can’t look at the menu.” If I’ve heard that said once, I’ve heard it said a thousand times, and it just makes me sick. I believe “lust” truly is the man’s “thorn in the flesh.”
Thanks for all you do.
Mark Joseph
I’ve heard it. I used to say it. I didn’t realize what that little rationalization was doing to me. I’ve since learned, when I don’t look at the menu, I don’t get tempted to eat.
Thank you – this is something that every man should read and seriously spend the time to dwell on.
And for a little extra spare change and a slight broadening of the subject…
When we look at those two passages, the point, of course is not the gold and braided hair, etc., itself. The point is that what we wear should not be a distraction from who we are. There’s more than just sexual modesty at play here. Whether we’re talking about too little, too much, too tight or too nice, if what we wear (no matter our body type—or gender) distracts from the fact that we are seeking to follow God, we need to find something else to wear.
Thank you for your honesty and candor on this controversial topic. I wish more men would speak on this so that women who sincerely don’t want to harm, will understand better what we can do to not entice the lust. Thanks again!
Thanks Bro. Crozier for the article- I’ve been working on a website off and on (mostly off) about this topic- could I post this article? The website is http://www.tohispraise.com.
Thanks,
Caleb George
Thanks for your encouragement, Caleb.
You are absolutely allowed to repost this article. I simply ask you provide a clear link back to the original.
Thanks.
Thank you for your candor, Edwin. As a woman, I still don’t understand how men think on this issue although I have been trying for 40 years. This gives women an insight to a man’s thinking, which is of great value when we are trying to dress “as one professing godliness”. May God bless us all as both men and women struggle with modesty.
Thanks, Neva.
I get your problem with understanding. At the same time, to be honest, I don’t understand why when my wife tells me about the problems in her day that she doesn’t actually want me to fix anything, she just wants me to listen. But I’m having to learn to understand her on that and just listen.
I think living with each other in an understanding way doesn’t mean understanding why it is the way it is, but just understanding it is that way and living accordingly.
And I concur in asking for God’s blessing. I know I need it.
Edwin:
Thank you for such an honest, open and scriptural analysis of what we as men struggle with. We are all sinners and the only way we will get to heaven is with the help of and by helping others get there. Such honest sharing is important in that we can know we are not alone in this. We are wired to be sexual beings and human sexuality is a special gift from God. The struggle is to keep that special gift within the proper context of marriage.
JB
Thanks, JB.
I’m learning that only when we struggle together can we overcome.
Edwin,
I appreciate your honesty and directness in dealing with this issue that we all face. Here are a couple of point I’ll add;
1) Being visually stimulated in our Internet/movie/TV based society, we must really be vigilant at turning off the TV/Movies and putting our computers in non-private places.
Psa 101:3
I will set no wicked thing before mine eyes: I hate the work of them that turn aside; [it] shall not cleave to me.
2) God knows how to deliver us, but we have to be willing to take that path, so we have a two part mission here: 1) Seek the paths of God and 2) Take the paths of God. This is very hard work and requires hard work on our part, but it is worth it.
2Pe 2:9
The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished:
2Pe 1:3-4
According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that [pertain] unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue: 4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
3) In your point 2 of “How does it affect me?” We must all remember that according to James 1:13-15, that Satan uses the tools we provide him. We have to work on not letting temptation drawn us away.
Jam 1:13-15
Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: 14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. 15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
Thank you for this article … Keep pressing on … Fight the good fight
Yours in Christ
Dan
Thanks for your extra advice, Dan.
I just read this on 01-02-2012, but let me tell you something it is a wonderfull article about lust. I like your sincerity with you and God; some time christians we have problem doing that; I try to do the same. be sincere. I live in El Salvador Central America, with my wife and 3 children. I became a christian 22 years ago. I´m not a gospel preacher, but I preach in our congregation 2 sundays per month. I have been studying very much the Bible and other spiritual book wich are help me to overcome my struggles. until now I had not read any book or article addressing this point straight, and clear. specially in Spanish there are not much material. I found this and it has been very helpfull for me. may God grant you the life, and blessing to you and your family. I will be in touch.
sincerely:
Osvaldo Rivas
Thanks, Osvaldo, for your comment and encouragement.
Edwin, very well said — right on target! Thanks for addressing an issue which faces every man (and woman, as you point out) in one way or another. You may know that Bette and I published a long article on this subject several years ago, when it seemed no one else would touch the subject. But ours was much more “clinical” and you have “personalized” common problems and proposed some very practical and helpful suggestions for addressing them. Thanks!
Thanks, Steve. I’m glad it is helpful. Thanks for your encouragement.
Thanks for your encouragement, Osvaldo.
Edwin, thank you. I did fall away from the Lord and spent 10 years in chat rooms and two affairs. Now that I have returned to the Lord and the Church, I struggle with lust. All of the above article is so true and too often, godly women really don’t understand and often don’t want to. They just think it is disgusting and find it hard to believe any man who calls himself a christian could have “those thoughts” or temptations. They need to face the fact that it is a problem and their husbands often need help overcoming years of habit fueled by an environment that constantly triggers their sin. Some wives don’t know, some are in denial, some know and through their silence enable their husbands habitual sin. Either way, wives need to know what is going on in the mind of a man and lovingly support him in his battle against satan. Husbands need to admit they have a problem and find help. The Church doesn’t have “programs” to address the problem but there are 12 Step Programs (Celebrate Recovery), 10 week programs (Valiant Men), small group studies (Setting Captives Free – The Way of Purity). All are put out by denominations and I would recommend them for someone versed in the truth but not for a new convert.
I would add two things… – It wouldn’t matter what a woman was wearing, man will find a way to want her if he is caught in the jaws of lust. While part of the problem is women, my mind and my eyes are my biggest problem.- Woman’s role is to dress modestly. My role is to not lust/keep my thoughts pure. Both man and woman need to glorify God in their bodies.- And I want to emphasize what you said, “I can’t blame others” What someone wears, what my wife did or didn’t do, how my marriage is going, what happened at work, on the freeway, problems with health, whats on TV, at the movies, on the computer, how I was raised…the list goes on…I am liable and in the day of judgement I will be held accountable. For some, myself included, it became a coping mechanism to deal with life without God. The only true way to peace is thru purity. No one is so far gone that God can’t help them. Lazarus was too far gone according to his sister Martha. Four days rotting in the a deep dark tomb. A body festering with rot and decay (I have been there) and Jesus was still able to bring him back and take off the wrappings of death and decay. Its not too late no matter how sick the soul is…Jesus truly is the great physician.
Thanks for chiming in. Jesus is the great physician. He is the solution for my sins and the victory over “this body of death” (Romans 7:24-25).
Thx for the great article and all the comments… Just excellent ! Recently I preached a series on Guard Your Heart and when addressing modesty I found the phrase “show your person not your parts” particularly effective… Now I am teaching a class on ” images” such an important topic in our day … Thx again for the good direct thoughts for us all
Gary, I love that line. I think I’ll have to borrow it.
About the ‘bouncing eyes’. There are many attractive women who men avoid even when they ARE dressing modestly, because these men are so afraid of lusting that they perceive an attractive woman as a threat, even when she isn’t doing anything wrong. These men won’t even look her in the eyes if he must speak to her, if he isn’t running in the opposite direction. How does that make her feel? Let me tell you, it hurts. It makes you feel like you are a bad person just because you are attractive. Being an attractive Christian is not a blessing because you are often treated like the plague. Men , you may need some balance and attitude adjustments. Cleavage may be a problem for you but it isn’t a sin if it shows (I am not talking about pasties)…and what if good toned arms are your thing…or pretty eyes? Are you going to run away from her and make her feel like she is dirty for being pretty? Attractive women in the church tend to be judged as seductive also….they are often not even asked out. I do not believe God intended for women to worry about covering up the very things that make them feminine, and I also agree God didn’t intend for women to advertise it either. But often this is subjective, in the eyes of the viewer, so people tend to get extreme on this issue… Burkas, anyone?
Hi Dee,
Thanks for chiming in with another side to the issue at hand. Certainly, being attractive is not a sin. I appreciate your insight because I think I can have a tendency to do the very thing you are describing, not because I think the woman is doing anything wrong, but because of what I know about myself. I certainly don’t want to do anything that would make an attractive woman think she is dirty or sinful just because she is attractive. I will pay attention to this in the future. Thank you.
I would like to suggest a possible rethink on the cleavage thing though. Maybe I have a wrong approach to this, but if a woman is showing the crevice where her breasts come together or are held apart, that means she is showing part of her breasts as well. How much of her breasts is a woman allowed to show before you would suggest it is immodest?
“Cleavage” anyone? No thanks! There’s no need for a woman to show off that area. I was born in ’56 and remember how the many of the older women dressed, for modesty sake. Now even too many women feel that more and more skin must be revealed so as not to be considered matronly. I work on a college campus and I had the dismay of seeing a young woman whom I’d considered devout, in a knee length dress. The only problem with it was the so-called cleavage. Too much was exposed as she a larage busom.